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Post 0

Saturday, September 17, 2005 - 5:46pmSanction this postReply
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Well, as I said, Andrew:

"You have to pick your fights. Sometimes you fight the fights you can win & sometimes you fight the ones that are worth fighting."

Libz were up against it due to a consolidation of the vote towards National. But that doesn't mean you don't stump up.

In my electorate, Aoraki, only four of us voted Libz. Wouldn't have mattered if I was the only one. The principle is what mattered.

Re the electorate vote down here. Jo Goodhew of National, who I voted for, slaughtered Jim Sutton, overturning his sizeable majority into a huge majority for National. Interestingly, National also took the party vote by a comfortable margin.

Sutton's been fucked & burned beyond all recognition but he'll slink & slither back in on the party list.

It'll be a minor miracle if the Nats can come from behind on special votes. They're ~20,000 in arrears and with ~200,000 (10% of the total) still to be counted, things would need to go dramatically against the trend to see them haul it back. That combined with the fact that Clark will mortgage what's left of her miserable soul to keep hold of the Treasury by fatuously kowtowing to the Maoris, and it looks like we're in for three more years rule by the Axis of Stupidity, a massive blowout in expectations courtesy of free student loans & the welfarisation of what's left of the middle class.

Ross



Post 1

Saturday, September 17, 2005 - 5:36pmSanction this postReply
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You will fight again another day.  The US Libertarian Party hit its high-mark nationwide in the 1980 election, and unfortunately hasn't come close since.

I'd be curious to know (if anyone knows out there) how many Libertarian Parties there are around the world.  I know of three (US, Canada, NZ).  I'm not interested in libertarian-friendly or libertarian-leaning parties... just those which are explicitly libertarian and aren't afraid to shout it from the rooftops!

This information might be useful to those who wish to defect from the US.  :-)


Post 2

Saturday, September 17, 2005 - 5:58pmSanction this postReply
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Sorry to hear the bad news, both the defeat of the Libz and the apparent reelection of Clark. Glad I'm not long the kiwi this weekend!

Post 3

Saturday, September 17, 2005 - 6:23pmSanction this postReply
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Robert,

The most relatively influential Libertarian (if you include Classical Liberals) party is Shinui, in Israel: they are Israel's third-largest party, with 15 seats in the 120-seat Knesset (Likud [Conservatives] have 37 seats, Labor[Socialists] have 19.) Thus neither the Socialist left nor the Religious-Nationalist Right can form a governing coalition without Shinui. But they are still a minority in any coalition government. And, because of internal disagreement within Shinui about the relative priority of the many action items on their Classical Liberal - Libertarian agenda, they are very short on practical accomplishment.


(Edited by Adam Reed
on 9/17, 11:06pm)


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Post 4

Saturday, September 17, 2005 - 7:03pmSanction this postReply
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Costa Rica has a very successful libertarian party:
http://www.libertario.org/

There also seems to be an embryonic libertarian party in Bangladesh:
http://maxpages.com/bangladeshlp

As for the reasons behind the disappointing election results, I believe Andrew has it right. Firstly, and most importantly, it was very much a two-horse race.

Secondly, we reap what we sow, and ideas are slow to germinate. We messed up in the last election, and we have paid for it this time. This year we ran an intense campaign, with more candidates than ever, and notably, a brilliant cinema advert. We have reached a huge number of people, but our ideas will require some time to take hold and grow. People who heard about us, and thought that some of our ideas made sense, will need time to digest and assimilate the concepts.

We need to keep feeding these little seedlings, by constantly getting our ideas out there. Repetition is a key factor. Personally, I know that I only grasped libertarianism after quite a few years, because every now and then, the ideas were reinforced by something I happened to stumble across.

If we maintain our current momentum over the next three years, by constantly pushing for cultural change through The Free Radical, radio shows, blogs and various other media, and simultaneously demonstrate that we are a dynamic and well-run organisation, then we will reap the rewards in the form of votes in the next election. More importantly though, we will reap our rewards in the number of minds opened to the concept of freedom. That is our true goal. Do not lose sight of it.

Post 5

Saturday, September 17, 2005 - 7:23pmSanction this postReply
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What can those of us outside NZ do to help Libertarianz?  Large sums of money?  (not applicable to yours truly but I thought I'd throw it out in case some old rich guy had a pile of cash he didn't know what to do with.  Now, if he's an old rich gay guy, I might marry him... but not in the US.  Darn.  I'm going to have to re-think my strategy.)

Post 6

Saturday, September 17, 2005 - 11:49pmSanction this postReply
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If there is a problem is it in common with a problem with the libertarian party in the US?

--Brant


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Post 7

Sunday, September 18, 2005 - 3:14amSanction this postReply
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This'll be a tad "in-house" for non-Kiwi SOLOists, but for Kiwi SOLOists not on the Libz libertyloop I post here what I've just said on that loop:

____________________________

I confess I hyped up my estimate of the number of votes I thought we'd get yesterday. I said 10,000. My quiet, private estimate was 3000. In the event, it was many fewer than that still. But there are no grounds for finger-pointing, recriminations or self-reproach. History was simply against us on this occasion. The National resurgence was a tide too powerful not to engulf us.

Some of you will be dejected; younger campaigners possibly in shock, even. No point in going into denial - wanton self-pity & getting leglessly pissed are entirely acceptable & understandable at this stage. But when you come to, think of everything that's been achieved. All that's missing is the vote-count to match.

President Scott Wilson hauled the party out of its post-2002-debacle doldrums with alacrity. Libz' systemic dysfunctionality was finally shaken off. The party is a credible entity with a professional look. Scott was the perfect person to drive that process. He'll be sorely missed, but figuring out who his successor should be is not rocket science.

Leaders Darnton & Pistorius are the sexiest of all party leaders. Conventional political wisdom says that's important, & it certainly doesn't hurt us that we conform to the conventional wisdom on this matter. Of course it helps that they espouse the right philosophy as well! These two make an excellent leadership team.

Candidates, office-holders, rank-&-file activists ... all of you smell of roses right now.

Last night I marvelled at the youth of many of those at the Wellington gathering ... at their energy, commitment, passion & intelligence. If these be the future faces of the party, then the party's future is bright indeed. Better yet, they are already the faces of the present.

Although in one sense they were tiresome, the endless loop messages about billboards being defaced or removed were inspiring at the same time. They bespoke a team effort such as we had not seen before. It's all very well being individualists - there are times when we must pull together for individualism! An election is one such occasion, & the billboards were a sign of how well Libz rose to it.

Craig Milmine does a superb job of producing the party newsletter. It's literate, energising, informative, inspirational. A huge asset.

PC's blog has become a force truly to be reckoned with. His commentary & insights are of the first rank. Intelligence, indignation, humour - Not PC has it all. In my view the party should figure out a way to remunerate him, at least nominally, so that Potts doesn't bash him with pots for not doing his day-job!

The Free Radical is still around, & it's still the best libertarian publication in the world. I'm very proud of the current issue, the Election Special, in particular. The heroic Ken Riddle has kept FreeRad afloat, but now is the time for a concerted effort to get subscription levels much higher & the magazine much more visible so that Ken's heroism becomes superfluous. My one personal disappointment, as its editor, is the way FreeRad still gets just taken for granted or is outright ignored. You just don't know what you've got here, folks. It too is a huge asset. Use it. Promote it. Support it. Four years inside the heart of darkness have taught me a lot. I'm now in a position to put that knowledge to good use. The FreeRad will only get better.

In short, courage, comrades! May our spirit be as invincible as our ideas are unassailable!

Linz


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Post 8

Sunday, September 18, 2005 - 6:57amSanction this postReply
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I think there's a trade-off between ideological purity and practical accomplishment. You can be in a minor party that expresses all the right ideas, but doesn't get elected, or you can be in a major party that sometimes makes serious mistakes, but has a realistic chance of implementing policies you support.


 


Post 9

Sunday, September 18, 2005 - 6:59amSanction this postReply
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I should add: I don't mean that as a negative comment about libertarianz, only as a general observation.

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Post 10

Sunday, September 18, 2005 - 7:56amSanction this postReply
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& lets not forget the efforts of Terry Verhoven, Tim Wikiriwhi, Robin Thompsen, Robert Palmer, Hooch, Russell Watkins (who after running for Tauranga MP is now having a crack at the council) and many others who I haven't mentioned here.

It was a marvellous effort - streets ahead of anything yet attempted. But the two big parties went all out to eliminate the minnows and Helen Clark is so disgusting that all but a hard core of small-party supporters gave their party vote to Don Brash. But in order to convince them to do this Don had to - half-heartedly - take up some of our ideas, and if our ideas get to parliament then we don't have to.

Take a break and have a beer all of you Libz in NZ, you deserve it. Bask in the Nanny-free time you will have while Clark et al. haggle over where they will sit in parliament. Hopefully the minor parties will prevaricate so much that they will break Winston Peters' record for time taken to form a coalition government!!!


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Post 11

Sunday, September 18, 2005 - 11:41amSanction this postReply
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quote        I think there's a trade-off between ideological purity and practical accomplishment. You can be in a minor party that expresses all the right ideas, but doesn't get elected, or you can be in a major party that sometimes makes serious mistakes, but has a realistic chance of implementing policies you support.
I've seen way too many libertarians try to make a run at accommodation within a major party, but it just doesn't work.

Post 12

Sunday, September 18, 2005 - 2:18pmSanction this postReply
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Robert, I admit if we're talking about parties dominated by the Religious Right, it's an uphill battle.

Post 13

Sunday, September 18, 2005 - 2:45pmSanction this postReply
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A hearty endoresement of Robt Winefield's Post 10. All the people he mentions were subsumed under "candidates, office-holders & rank-&-file activists" in my post. I was scared if I started a lengthy roll of honour I'd inadvertently leave some deserving person off, senile as I am. :-)

Linz

Post 14

Sunday, September 18, 2005 - 3:23pmSanction this postReply
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I was scared if I started a lengthy roll of honour I'd inadvertently leave some deserving person off, senile as I am.
Oh darn - I was sitting here hoping for a repeat of the famous Kirstie Alley acceptance speech at the 1991 Emmys, when she thanked her (then)husband Parker Stevenson "for giving me the big one for the last eight years".

(appropriate as this is Emmy night - yeah yeah, so shoot me... I'm an award-show queen.)


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